Interview in Portland, revisited

Well, I earlier posted a link to an interview a journalist had with me when I was sleeping on the streets of Portland. The link didn't work for a while, but then resurfaced so now I'm going to post the whole article so as not to lose it again. I pretty much agree with what I said back then, except for my comments about marriage--back then, I make it sound as if I'm only interested in dating or marriage with someone who wants or is open to living the homeless lifestyle. That's no longer true.

The following is a section of an online book called Youth Stories by Eric Marley.

Chapter 3 Nathan



Sometimes I am frustrated by my inability to go back and ask follow-up questions. Nathan is one of the best examples I can site of this inadequacy, including what are probably poor technical interviewing techniques as well. However, he is a good example of the educated homeless; those whose stated reason to be on the street are different than the standard ones. My frustration with this interview is my inability to get to the bottom of the real reason for his homelessness. I think it has more to do with his "weakness" than he is admitting. That notwithstanding, he was an interesting young man and a breath of fresh air – a nice change from some of the more heart-wrenching stories I'd heard that day.



Nathan was laying in a doorway at about 8 am on March 10, 2007 when we first passed him. After another interview we passed by him again and he was rolling his sleeping bag. I noticed his bright eyes, cheerful countenance and North Face sleeping bag – none of these being standard equipment for homeless people. I was overcome with curiosity. This interview is the result of that. Nathan seemed to be an example of one of the good but confused people on the road. He's not addicted to drugs, there was no alcohol on his breath and he certainly doesn't seem to be a violent person. But there were in congruencies, holes in his story. There were also references to some undisclosed weakness that he was battling. This notwithstanding, whether he is being completely honest with himself or not he is almost certainly doing others some good with his ready smile and sense of humor.



Interview: March 10, 2007

Place: Portland, Oregon in a doorway on 9th street near Burnside, about 10:45 am

Weather: Overcast

Subject: Nathan, 23 years old.



Your name?

Nathan.



Where is your hometown?

Well, I grew up overseas in different places. I guess the closest thing is Quakertown, Pennsylvania.



Did you live there long?

Maybe about 3 years total. Not too long.



What's your education level, Nathan?

College graduate.



I knew it!

(We both laugh uproariously)



Where did you graduate from and what was your major?

Grover City College in Pennsylvania. My major was Christian Thought.



Interesting. So why are you out of doors?

I'm traveling. I've been hitchhiking. I want to visit some different Christian communities throughout the US. I also want to learn what it's like to be out in the streets, learn from the people. Just be with them.



What are you learning?

Um, I think I'm learning that it's easy to judge but it's hard to love.



What are you going to do with this information?

I'm trying to explain…it's much easier to learn experientially. But I'm trying to explain through my blog and through emails and stuff to my friends and family just what the lifestyle's like so they can come to a better understanding about how they can relate to the homeless. So I hope to basically tell other people from the middle class so they would come to a better understanding and have more compassion and more wisdom I guess, relating to the homeless.



Why is that important to you? You're a college graduate – you could have a more comfortable life I would imagine.

I worked two years with AmeriCorps. The second year I worked with homeless families. Basically calling up shelters and helping them get into shelters. And I realized that there's a lot of help out there for the homeless, but there is not a lot of compassion. So…I think primarily what we need as a middle class, the people that have their stuff together, to learn how to humble themselves and to help other people out, and not be so concerned about their own needs as the needs of others. And what people out in the streets need is not so much a judgmental attitude, "you need to stop drinking" or "you need to stop drugs", but more of a compassionate, "hey, do you want to sit here and chat?" Not necessarily offering anything, but just becoming friends, and creating that dialogue. I think that for too long we've been separating ourselves – the middle class has been moving out into the suburbs, and leaving the city. Now the rich are moving back into the city and kicking the poor out to who-knows-where – somewhere else.



How is this tied to your spirituality? You obviously consider yourself a spiritual person.

Yes. I've been learning a lot about faith and about life through the eyes of the homeless. I went on this trip because of my faith in Christ. I'd say it's taught me that my weaknesses are still the same when I'm on the streets as they were beforehand. I had this idealistic thing, "well, maybe I won't struggle as much with my pet sins because I'll have to be constantly relying on God to help me through this. Boy, that was a big mistake.



So they're still there.

Oh yeah. So, I'm going back to LA because…I guess that's my new hometown since I stayed there two years recently.



Was that also with AmeriCorps?
Yes, but I was also doing an internship with a missionary group called "Servants To Partners." They sent teams overseas to the slums, so, I'm going to go back there and kind of reconnect with some friends and develop more of accountability, a stronger accountability.



Tell me about your family. How do they feel about you being out here – are they worried?

Um, I think my parents are okay with me being out here. They were Christian missionaries.



They were? So they probably had similar experiences?

I would say my lifestyle growing up in Korea and South Africa was maybe slightly lower middle class lifestyle of an American so I was pretty comfortable growing up. Since then I've come to a deeper conviction of the reality of suffering in the world and the need to take on some of that suffering in order to be a real person. To be involved in helping other people and being "Jesus" to them.



I think the Christian doctrine is that Jesus "descended below all things", so you are really trying to emulate his path, is that correct?

Yes, I think that in following Jesus – which is essentially what being a Christian is – it's not all the other things that people add on. I don't even label myself a Christian because people misunderstand what it means. Yeah, so, following Jesus means taking up your cross, which means suffering. He said if anyone would come after me he must deny himself, take up his cross daily and follow me. So I don't claim to be doing that right now. One of my favorite philosophers, Soren Kierkegaard, said he didn't claim to be a Christian because he didn't think he was actually following the level that Jesus called his followers to follow. But…I'm trying to anyways.



You're making an effort.

Yes, I'm making an effort.



And yet, as an outsider, I'd say you're going through tremendous lengths to try to follow Jesus in your understanding of people that are less advantaged than you.

Yes.



So is it your weaknesses, or things you want to overcome, is that part of it, too?

Yes, I'd say it is. Some people distinguish between their 'social gospel' and there's this whole camp of people like that and then there's this other camp of people that are all about holiness. "Oh I have to not do certain things, or be a certain person." Well, I think Jesus encapsulates both of those together. He was a very holy person – and to distinguish holiness again from what some people think Christians view to be, such as not smoking and drinking and all that stuff. I'm talking about holiness as being set apart for God's work. God is holy and that means he is set apart. So that means…it's very complicated since he's also with us. So…um, I think that the important thing is for personal holiness, values, to also be motivated by love, which means action. Right now I'm struggling with personal holiness values. So I need to kind of reconnect with God on a personal level to deal with some of those issues. So and then I'll better be able to help others out. You can't help others if you're not working and trying to help yourself.



Where do you want to be in 5 years?

I'd like to be two places in five years. Either overseas with a team such as Servants To Partners helping to see Gods kingdom come into a third world slum or somewhere here in the US hitchhiking traveling around on foot, but by that time with an established community that I can always come back to. Um, so there's a community called "Simple Way" in Philadelphia. It's a group of believers that have come together and they are living in a run down area. They live together, pool their resources. So it's not just a community in the sense that they meet together, they also live together.



So it's like a commune?

Yes, exactly. So at that point I'd either like to be overseas or here in the US with a community that I can come back to.



Do you want to have a family of your own someday?

It's kind of up in the air. That's a good question. I do think that my family in a lot of ways is the people I'm with wherever I am. That's one of the things I love about traveling. It's meeting completely new people and establishing this connection – you know you feel like you've been brothers or sisters for a long time. I'm open to eventually getting married. I wouldn't say I'm going to pursue it right now, but I'm hoping to. There aren't too many women out there who want to travel around hitchhiking, sleeping in doorways. (Laughs). But there's a few I think. Actually one of the things that got me interested in this was an article in Prism magazine (an evangelical magazine that talks about issues related to social justice) about this homeless couple in France. One was a former Franciscan priest that started going out on visits with a Franciscan brother, living in shelters and sleeping outside with the homeless – he felt that God was calling him to do this. And actually he met a lady that was serving at a shelter and she wanted to go out with them so the three of them went around for a while. Eventually he got married to her, so he renounced his celibacy vows and they went around as a couple. About three quarters of the year they would be out on the streets.



So is the path you're on now going to help you be where you want to be in 5 years?

Yeah, I've been visiting different communities in the US. I spent a week in a monastery – that was interesting. I also spent a week in a 500 person Christian commune in Chicago. Just north of Chicago they had another one where they had different houses where they would live together. But the one 500 person one in Chicago they all lived in an old hotel, right in uptown Chicago. Jesus People USA. They run a shelter there and it's pretty cool.



What's the name of your blog?

Wannabemendicant.blogspot.com



What is a mendicant?

That's a beggar. The mendicants were, in the earlier church, back in the middle Ages, the mendicant orders were groups of people like Saint Francis and his followers. But I've only panhandled a couple of times. I kind of see it in a spiritual sense – a beggar for God.



Thanks, Nathan.

You're welcome.


http://bookbanshee.securespsite.com/Sociology/Youth%20Stories%20-%20Book%20In%20Progress.doc